(812) The Mexican Coin Answer Man: Volume 2 Issue 8: Last Revision: 04/24/07

We have had almost 100 email comments and questions since Issue #7 of MCM; we have tried to answer each and every one of them. Here are a few of the more interesting ones for our readers.

First a few comments about Mexican Coin Magic:

Hi Sir,
Saw your article online on Grading Mexican coins, interesting as the way
to grade the Mexican Reales that are produced at different mints and dies.
There is a need to have a standard to follow for grading Mexican coin just like US coins (Third party grading companies … Good Graders with the experience and passion may be difficult to find and will affect the grading standards of the coins). Just some of my comments ...
Hope to see more articles on the characteristics of the coins produced by different mints.
Can you recommend any good references on the above topics?

Thanks & Regards
Thomas

Hello to all my friends, Unfortunately I had a coin lost or stolen at the Pharr show. I really don't know which but after looking thru my entire collection I do know it's no longer in my procession. So if you run across this coin, please purchase it for me and I'll be happy to reimburse you for your trouble. Attached is a close up of the date on this one peso 1903 Mo AM 9 over an inverted 9. Only one known so far.

Best regards, Jim Lowe

Hello, I am a relatively young (26) collector, fascinated with portrait and Republican 8 Reales coins, and wanted to thank you for creating your website. It’s a fantastic source of information and I hope there are plans to continue the Issues.

Thank you again,

Roman  

Question #1:

Subject: Values

Harold

Answer #1:

Hello Harold, thank you for your interest and questions about Mexican coins. I will try to answer your questions separately.

Unfortunately, we cannot recommend any current catalog/book over another. They all list values for Mexican coins, but most tend to under value rare and/or high grade examples of Colonial, War of Independence, Republic, Iturbide or Maximilian coins and over value common ones. The same can be said of the Revolutionary and 20th Century with the exception that many of the Revolutionary issues almost never come in high grade (True Extra Fine or better). Most serious collectors of 20th Century Mexican coins do not bother with circulated examples of 20th Century/Modern coins as almost all can be found in mint state with little or no trouble and relatively inexpensively especially when comparing them to US coins of a similar type/mintage. The exceptions are:

2 centavos - 1922 (I know of one Choice Mint State example)

5 centavos - 1931 (I know of 2 or 3 Choice Mint State examples, the reason I say 2 or 3 is that people could be talking about the same coin in a couple of cases)

20 centavos - 1908 (this coin can occasionally be found in UNC, but a fully struck CHOICE UNC specimen probably does not exist).

1 peso - 1911 Short Ray (much, much rarer than the 1914 in Mint State)       

1 peso - 1949 Proof (I hesitate to use this one as it was not struck for circulation, that is similar to the 1969 and a few others)

The 1920 and 1921 1 peso pieces that are fully struck up are difficult to locate.

1 peso - 1934/3, unlisted in the catalogs, probably less than 10 known

There is no exchange rate for any Mexican coins dated prior to 1992 as the government of Mexico does not accept them. Mexico revalued its monetary system in 1992 and all coins dated prior to 1992 are no longer accepted as legal tender). For all coins dated since 1992 the current exchange rate fluctuates between 10.1 and 10.6 pesos to the US dollar. 

The rest have no value other than numismatic and/or bullion (for the silver or gold).

Most dealers who handle the base metal (cupro-nickel, stainless steel, copper, brass, etc.) coins minted between 1955 and 1992 buy them by the pound and sell them the same way. Keep in mind there are a few exceptions, and some are collectible because they are relatively scarce. One example that readily comes to mind is the 1977 50 centavos. That coin - if it is Uncirculated - will actually bring up to $20 or more depending on how nice.

If you will send me a list of the pre-1900 coins you have in the following manner, I will try to give you some idea of their retail and wholesale value.

Denomination  Mint (see below) Date Assayer Initial  & Grade (see attached Grading Primer, almost without exception the coins listed on EBay are overgraded, this includes slabbed coins)

1. Alamos - As

2. Catorce - Ce

3. Chihuahua - Ca

4. Culiacan - Cn

5. Durango - Do

6. Estado De Mexico - EoMo

7. Guadalajara - Ga

8. Guadalupe y Calvo - GC

9. Guanajuato - Go

10. Hermosillo - Ho

11. Mexico City - Mo

12. Oaxaca - Oa

13. San Luis Potosi - Pi

14. Zacatecas - Zs

For example, if you have an Estado De Mexico 2 Reales  you would list it as 2R EoMo 1828 LM Very Fine

By the way, I would pay $1,000 for a True VF example of the above coin. The 2007 North American Coins & Prices: A Guide To U.S., Canadian and Mexican Coins catalog lists it for $525 in Very Fine.  

Apologies if we overwhelmed you with information, but your questions are part of why we started the www.MexicanCoinMagic.com web site. Unlike US coins where there is readily available information about the rarity of every coin struck by the United States, the information about Mexican coins is sparse, sporadic, and often unreliable. We hope to change that.

If you want to see what better coins bring, we suggest you log onto Ponterio & Associates website and check out the Prices Realized for the Republic 8 Reales that were featured in Sale #139 which took place on September 8, 2006. The Prices Realized should be posted within a week or so. You can then compare them to catalog values. Please feel free to write anytime you have a question or comment about the coins of Mexico.

Respectfully,

Dave Busse

Numismatist

Question #2:

A reader from India sent us a scan of a very nice Uncirculated US $5 Gold Piece asking for information about it and if we were interested in buying the coin.

Answer #2:

Mr. Kumar

I'm sorry I'm not a buyer, nor do I know very much about the value of US coins, as we specialize only in Mexican coins. Dear friend if you find any silver or gold coins from Mexico in India (Many were shipped there in the 1800s) I will be more than happy to help you find a new home for them.

Sincerely,

Ralph Poucher

Mexican Coin Magic

Question #3:

Subject: Dealer Inquiry

Just sent Frank Maher & Arleen Huges an email to an address (panamex @....)
I found for them on the PCGS dealer page. Unfortunately, it was returned as
undeliverable. Would you by any chance have an email for either of them.

Am thinking about selling some or all of my collection, most of which was
acquired from Frank many a year ago in California. Frank always had
spectacular material & sure would like to do business with him if possible.

Any help you could give me in locating Frank or Arleen would be appreciated.
Thanks,  Gary

Answer #3:

Hello Gary, this was forwarded to me from Ralph Poucher who, as you now, is
the driving force behind Mexican Coin Magic. I have known Frank for many years
and if I'm not mistaken, I believe he has retired. Unfortunately, I'm not
sure of how to contact him anymore. I will check with a couple of folks I
know to see if they might be able to give us a way to get in touch with him.
I too have bought several coins from Frank over the years and have always
been satisfied. Bought a screamer GC 8R from him about four years ago, it is
my Type 8R for Guadalupe y Calvo.

I am a member of the Mexican Coin Magic staff and am still actively collecting
(pictures of my Maximilian coins are in the latest edition of MCM). If you
would consider me and/or Ralph, we would certainly like an opportunity to
purchase any or all of your Mexican or Latin American coins. We pay full
retail for any coins that we  purchase for our own collections and very
attractive prices for all others. If you would send a list of your coins by:

Denomination
Mint
Year
Assayer
Variety if necessary to properly describe/attribute it
Grade

to either to me, Ralph or both of us; we would examine the list and let you
know what we think. If you know how much you want for the coins please
include that. Scans or photos are nice but not essential. If need be we can
fly to meet you and examine the coins in the flesh. Even if you do not want
to consider us as a potential buyer for you collection, we would very much
appreciate the list of your holdings in order to add appropriate
information to the FoxLair Reference Collection data base as we believe the
information would be helpful to all serious collectors.

We are both experienced numismatists specializing in the Coins of Mexico and
Latin American. We have done business - both buying and selling - with all
of the major dealers in Mexican Coins including but not limited to; Mike
Dunigan, Rick Ponterio, Richard Long, Jed Crump, Pat Johnson; Toby Qualls,
Heritage Coins, American Numismatic Rarities (recently handled the Eliasberg
Collection of Foreign Gold), Larry & Ira Goldberg, and Superior Coin
Galleries to name some. We can honestly state that we almost always pay more
than the "Big Boys" because our overhead is not as great as theirs.
Moreover, we provide prompt service and deal directly with you, which
eliminate middlemen.

If you would like a list of references, please let us know.

I'm sorry I could not be of more help about Frank, but we sincerely thank
you for your inquiry and hope to hear from you again in the very near
future.

Respectfully,

Dave Busse
Member ANS, ANA, USMexNA
956-440-8235
dbusse@rgv.rr.com

Question #4:

                                                                                           Brad.... 

Answer #4:

Hello Brad, thanks for your question. The is legitimately Rare. However, because of the hole it is worth very little to collectors. We would not recommend having it slabbed and the cost would quite likely be more than the coin is worth. 

While it is hard to say exactly what such a piece might bring on the retail market, but we would doubt that it would exceed $25-50.

Thank you for your interest and we hope the information is of use to you.

Sincerely,

Dave Busse

Mexican Coin Magic

Question #5:

Dear Mexican Coin Magic Answer Man;

Have there been any articles that you know of written about the Mexico 1898 Peso that was restruck in San Francisco in 1949 for Chiang Kai-Shek's Nationalist government?

I have been researching these unusual coins for some time and know the basic facts about them, such as the different denticle counts.

I am looking for answers to the following questions:
Did the Mexican government approve of the making of these coins?
What port in China were these coins shipped to?
How did they enter the coin market (they show up on eBay sometimes).

I spent some time reading several books about the late 1940's Chinese revolution and could find nothing about these coins or the 1934 China dollar coins restruck at the same time.

I did write a short article about these coins and it is at:
http://home.earthlink.net/~brianrxm/mexsf/mexsf.htm

I found the Mexican Coin Magic website from a posting on the Collectors Universe forum at:
http://forums.collectors.com/messageview.cfm?catid=6&threadid=536860

Thank you.

Brian

Answer #5:

Hello Brian, we are most pleased that you found our web site and will try to answer your questions as best we can.

As you probably already know, there were a total of 10,250,000 restrikes of the Mexican peso dated 1898 produced. Of those 8,250,000 were actually struck at the Mexico City Mint (Casa de Moneda de Ciudad de Mexico) with the remaining 2,000,000 being struck at the United States Mint in San Francisco. As far as we have been able to determine it is impossible to differentiate between those struck in Mexico City and those produced at San Francisco since the working dies were undoubtedly prepared from master dies. Since the bulk were struck in Mexico City there seems little doubt that the Mexican Government approved the striking and almost assuredly struck them for a fee. Remember, there is a long history (beginning in the late 16th Century and lasting until well into the 20th Century) of Mexico producing Trade Dollars which were accepted world wide with a substantial portion of them being shipped to China and/or the Far East.

I am sorry but I have never researched them to the depth of determining to which Chinese port they were shipped. If the shipments were prior to Mao's forces driving Chiang Chie-shih's (Chiang K'ai-shek in Mandarin) forces to T'aiwan then my best guess would be the port of Shang-hai. If they were shipped after the Nationalist retreat to T'aiwan it would probably be either T'aipei or Tai'chung, T'aiwan (Am using Wade-Giles rather than the PRC's Version of transliteration. For example, in Wade-Giles the capitol of China would be Pei-ching or Pei-jing while in the PRC's transliteration it would be Bei-zhing. In any event, the "ch, "j" or "zh" is pronounced as a Hard J in English and the T' is pronounced like a T. If it is a T without the apostrophe then it is pronounced like a D).

Again, there is no way to state categorically exactly how the coins entered numismatic market. Obviously, some were hoarded and Chinese as well as the Mexicans have historically been skeptical of banks, especially in times of social and political upheaval.

Consequently, merchants, and citizens would have hung onto coins containing precious metal and used paper currency if those they were conducting business with would accept it. The Mexican peso of that day was valued for its reliability and silver content rather than its denomination. Merchants and consumers considered all coins to be worth the amount of gold or silver that was in them rather than where they came from or what the specific denominations were. They believed, and rightfully so, that if a coin contained no silver, gold or other precious metal it was only worth the public's faith in the government that was issuing the specie. Therefore, there would be cases where the coins were exchanged for whatever commodity was needed and those accepting the coins, as payment would then sell them to others for their silver content. As a result, a number wound up in the hands of individuals who again would sell them to individuals who had an interest in the numismatic aspect of the coins. Due to the high mintages, it is doubtful that the coins will ever - in our lifetimes - be rare numismatically though they will probably remain popular to numismatists who desire to know about the historical as well as the commercial aspects of this interesting coin.  

Apologies, but I have little knowledge about the 30 million Chinese dollars (assume you are referring to Y # 345) restruck in three different United States mints other than the fact that all were dated Year 23 by the Chinese calendar which would equate to 1934 using our calendar. 

In summation, we would offer our opinion that both restrikes were an attempt by the United States to prop up the Nationalist Chinese Government which, at that time, was being soundly defeated both politically and militarily by the Mao led Chinese Communists. 

FYI, an easier way (rather than trying to count the denticles) to determine if it is a restrike is by looking at the numeral 1 in the date. On the original the number has a straight serif and it tapers to a short base. On the restrike it is a curved serif and it has a long thin base (Buttrey-Hubbard, A Guidebook of Mexican Coins 1822 To Date 6th Edition, Iola, WI, Krause Publications, 1992, p. 160.)

We hope this information is helpful and please do not hesitate to contact us anytime you think we may be able to assist you.

Respectfully,

Dave Busse

Numismatist

Mexican Coin Magic  

Question #6:

Thank you for your response. The coin is silver and is Mexican. It is a 8 Reales. It has an eagle on one side and a cap with sun and rays on the other. The date is 1834. Does it have value?

Thanks,
Don

Answer #6:

Hello Don, thanks for your question and am sorry about the delay in getting
back to you, have been out of town for a few days.

The 1834 8R was struck at 7 different mints
Chihuahua - Ca
Durango - Do
Guadalajara - Ga
Guanajuato - Go (o inside the lop of the G
Mexico City - Mo (o is centered above the M)
San Luis Potosi - Pi
Zacatecas - Zs

The Chihuahua had two different assayers (the letters immediately following
the date), MR and AM. Both are Rare and worth at least $125 even in low
grade. The higher the grade the more the value. None of the others struck
that year are considered Rare. Retail values for those more common pieces
would range from $250 in low grade to over $2,500 in Uncirculated.

Dave Busse

Question #7:

Hi my name is Angela and I have been researching information on a coin similar to this except the mint is a G the denomination is 8 E.G. and the assayer's initials are Y. F I have not found anything to help me find the value. Angela        P. S. I have attached a picture

Answer #7:

Angela

You have an 8 Escudo from the Guanajuato Republican Mint in central Mexican. This mint was the greatest of the 14 Republican era Mexican mints that produced more gold and silver than any other mint from 1824 until it closed in 1897. Your coin was valued at $16 US dollars when it was minted and today they are worth from about $350 to over $5,000 depending on the year, assayer, mintmark, and condition of the coin. Your coin is one of the more common 8 Escudos from this mint. From your scans it appears your coin should grade about Extra Fine making it worth approximately $600 to $750.

The large "G" you mentioned is the mintmark, look closely at your coin and you will also note there is a small "o" inside the "G" which indicates the Guanajuato Mint. The "8E" indicates it is an 8 Escudo. The "YF" indicates the assayer who was responsible for guaranteeing its weight and fineness.

I hope I have helped answer some of your questions? If you want more information contact me again with your questions and I will try to answer them.

Thanks for the great question

Ralph Poucher

Mexican Coin Magic 

Question #8:

Dear Mr. Answer Man

I have considered myself as an experienced collector of World coins for 30 yrs. Yet I would be happy to know more about the coin I show for you in attached file. 8 reales KM. 377.10. STRUCK in copper or bronze, weight 27.1 grams, reeded edge. Is it a pattern? Or is it a contemporary strike? Is it a frequent piece? Valuable?

Very happy for an answer and with best collectors regards

Ola in SWEDEN

Answer #8:

Dear Ola:

Thanks for your question. And this is a tuff one to answer without having the coin in hand to look at.

After just took a quick look at you scans, the images are very good, my first guess is that it is possibly a trial strike in off-metal. I have collected the Mexican Republic 8 Reales & 8 Escudos for over 25 years and I have never seen or heard of this coin. If it is real it is very rare. 

But you said it has a reeded edge. I'm unaware of any trials during this period with reeded edges. Is it possible to see the edge design of this coin?

Another thing that concerns me is the weight, if it is in copper or brass? Can you measure the thickness of the coin and tell me what it is?  However, recently I bought a Colonial 8 Escudo trial or counterfeit found in Canada that the owner failed to say was triple thick that appears to be an unlisted trial strike in copper.   

I have never seen this DAM (Date-Assayer-Mintmark) as a trial strike, but they could exist, as I own a Mo 1869 CH 8 Escudo trial strike in copper. However, your coin could also be a good contemporary counterfeit too?

The value of the coin has been reduced because of the test drilling on the one side. This makes me think it may have one time been gilded or plated and someone was testing it to see if it was a gold or silver coin. All patterns & trial strikes are valuable, usually worth more than the actual coins. I also collect contemporary counterfeits and fake 8 Reales and 8 Escudos. If it is truly a trial strike, even with the test drilling I would value it from about $300 to $600 in US Dollars. If it is triple thick $500+. If it is a contemporary counterfeit it is work from $15 to $25. If it didn't have the test drilling and it is a real trial strike it would be worth from $800 to $1,000. I paid $700 for the above-mentioned Mo 1869 CH 8 Escudo copper trial strike a number of years ago when I bought it, and $360 for the Colonial 8 Escudo piece.

If you can measure the thickness and send me a picture of the edge I can hopefully tell you a little bit more about the coin.

I hope this information helps you?

Ralph Poucher

Mexican Coin Magic

More from Ola from Sweden

Dear Ralph

I am quite overwhelmed by the speed and the content in your answer! Being an experienced collector of world coins since decades, I really appreciate this. Since I have no tools for measuring exact thickness of my coin, I attach scan of my ordinary 8 reales 1863 Mo Silver including edge picture. Thickness is the same as on my COPPER coin, see scan of edge on that. The Diameter of COPPER coin is 38.5 mm, compared to 37mm for ordinary SILVER piece. In my opinion the copper piece is a STRUCK coin with test cuts as you mentioned. I really hope this can contribute to the "diagnosis" of coin. I have seen many 8 Reales, but I guess you have seen many thousands more. I guess I finally met an expert and that is why I also send picture of one of my rare Mex coins sold at eBay. Is this really as rare as the paid price $2600 indicates? Sitting in Sweden is a bit off from center of Mexican coin universe.

Once again, your efforts in revealing the truth of my copper 8 Reales are really appreciated.

Ola in Sweden

Question #9:

Subject: 2r pi 1830 Js

Dave, I see that you recently got a batch of 1 Real coins that contained 2 low grade 1R C 1848 CE coins.  Are you trying to corner the market in that date?  I have only seen 4 available for sale in the past 3 years.  I got one in Fine, and you have the other 3 now.  I have a feeling that the C 1850 CE, C 1853 CE, and C 1856 CE 1 Reales are scarcer than the C 1848 CE 1R, but the 1848 seems to be pretty tough.  I know you will mention the 1863, but I prefer to spend my time pondering coins that I have a chance of acquiring.

Bill 

Answer #9:

Bill, like your Pi 2R, I decided to pass on bidding and am glad I did as either you or I would have paid much more than $13.

Like you I believe it is most useful. Assume you were using the seller's grades?

I opine that if you analyze the UNC 4R, you will find that most of those offered were late Zacatecas with a few late Potosi and Guanajuato mixed in. Don't believe they were actual Hoard Coins but suspect that somehow a good number did not circulate. Would make an interesting story if the actual story could be uncovered.

Regarding your expectation that high grade minors are retained in collections, I would agree with that completely. However, I would offer that HGM are as scarce as your data reflects because:

1) There are just not that many serious collectors of Republic Real Minors. I suspect that in the US and Mexico combined there are not more than 3 or 4 hundred serious minor collectors. I know some serious collectors and have data on others. Without exception, if they are collecting a specific series by Date and/or Variety they all have large gaps between mint state examples even if they have most of the coins. There are a few exceptions to that. For example, I believe that is possible to acquire a complete Date Set of Mexico City 1/2R in mint state. However, I also believe that if it were done, the number who could boast of such a feat would be very small. 

My research has convinced me the following either does not or do not come in UNC or there are less than 5 known specimens (all dates) in mint state:

1/2 Reales

1. As (assuming it is genuine)

2. Ca

3. EoMo

4. GC

5. Ho

6. Mo - Hookneck

1 Reales

1. Ca

2. Do - Hookneck

3. EoMo

4. GC

5. Ho

2 Reales

1. As

2. Ca

3. Ce

4. Do - Hookneck

5. Do - European Dies

6. EoMo

7. Ga

8. GC

9. Ho

10. Mo - Hookneck

4 Reales

1. Ce

2. GC

3. Ho

4. Mo - 1827/6

5. Oa - I know of one mint state example

Dave

Question #10:

Hi,

I am an Australian numismatist who is struggling to find out information regarding distinguishing between the 2 varieties of: KM#377.6, Mexico 1860 Ga JG 8 Reales as listed in Krause...the "w/o dot" variety versus the "dot in loop of eagles tail (base alloy)"...

Can you provide me with, or direct me, to information on this particular coin so I can decide which of the two varieties I might have?

Any help will be greatly appreciated!

Regards

Scott

Answer #10:

Great Question Scott!

Someone, much smarter than me, once said, “A picture is worth a thousand words!” Therefore I wonder if four scans are worth four thousand words?  In order help you solve your problem I’m sending the write-up and scans of both coins from the FoxLair Republic 8 Reales Reference Collection^© of both Cap & Rays and Eagle sides so you can determine which coin you have:

* 8R. G^A. 1860. J.G.

Overall DAM Very Rare, Dot in Snake’s Tail [Ga-1860-1101] Extremely Rare; Average: VF to aXF, some aUncs are found, but generally weakly struck

 [2] Ga-1860-1101 Style of 1846 Cap & Rays: Dot in Snake’s Tail Normal Date & Assayer; Style of 1846 Eagle:

Weight: 27.0 grams

Scott note the small dot in the tail of the snake near the Eagle’s wing. The assayer or mint master put this dot there in order to prove the coin was not up to federal standards so that when the Guadalajara Mint was recaptured by federal forces these coins could be easily found and withdrawn from circulation.

[2] Ga-1860-1102 Style of 1846 Cap & Rays: No Dot in Snake’s Tail Normal Date & Assayer; Style of 1846 Eagle: ex Robert Lawson-FoxLair Reference Collection                      Weight: 27.15 grams

Scott note no dot in snake’s tail.  Hope this helps you?  Good to see we have some readers “down-under”!

Ralph Poucher

More from Aussie Scott:

Hi and thanks Ralph,

I appreciate the information and it answered my question...and so I have the "no dot" variety...finally I can say that for certain!

As for how I found the site Ralph, it was from "googling" Mexico coins and I think you were to the side in the Google ad space (I think?! lol)

I found the site very informative Ralph, and for someone who knows very little about the substantial volume of varieties of these coins, it was a blessing to have access to such individual information...

...of most benefit was the expedient response time Ralph, I am most impressed as I wasn't expecting an answer for some time - if at all to be honest...so in that department your site gets my MS-66 approval rating! LOL

Take care and thanks once again Ralph,

Regards

Scott

Question #11:

I have 3 Gold Mexican coins. I believe all 3 are BU or maybe Gem. I recently bought these coins from a neighbor. Thank you for your help.

• 1873 20 Pesos (Balance Scale)

• 8 Escudo 1870 (Hand on Book)

• 2 Escudo 1859 (Hand on Book)

Tom

Answer #11:

Hello Tom;

Congratulations on your recent purchase!

If your coins are as you believe, either BU or GEM, you are one lucky guy. Almost all Mexican Republic gold coins in these exalted grades are quite rare. I presume from your inquiry you would like to know a little more about these coins, even though you didn't ask any specific questions about them?

In order to help you, I'm going to need a little more information about each coin. During the Mexican Republic Period (1823 to 1905) Mexico minted five denominations of gold escudos and later five denominations of gold pesos.

The gold escudos:

•     1/2 Escudo: minted from 1825 to 1870 were valued at about $1 US dollar

•     1 Escudo: minted from 1825 to 1870 were worth about $2 US dollars

•     2 Escudos: minted from 1825 to 1870 were worth $4 US dollars

•     4 Escudos: minted from 1825 to 1869 were valued at $8 US dollars

•     8 Escudos: minted from 1823 to 1873 were the equivalent of $16 US dollars

 The gold pesos:

•     1 Peso: minted from 1870 to 1905 and valued at $1

•     2 1/2 Pesos: minted from 1870 to 1893 were worth $2.5

•     5 Pesos: 1870 to 1905 were worth $5 

•     10 Pesos: 1870 to 1905 were the same as $10

•     20 Pesos: 1870 to 1905 were valued as $20

Some denomination escudos were minted in up to 12 different mints, the gold pesos in 10 deferent mints. Like US gold coins except the Philadelphia mint, each of the Mexican mints had a different mintmark. Unlike US gold coins, each mint also had the initials of the assayer (the person or persons who were responsible for the quality of each coin) stamped on each coin. Some mints made all denominations of gold escudos and pesos, others only a few. Some mints made very few gold coins, others made many in many different years.

Now that you know a little about your three coins, here is what I need to know about your three coins:

1873 20 Pesos: this coin was minted in four different mints this year; Chihuahua (mintmark CH), Culiacan (mintmark Cn), Guanajuato (mintmark Go), and Mexico City (mintmark Mo). Each of these different mint's 20 Pesos for this year are valued at different prices in different grades. You will find the mintmark on the side of the coin where you found VEINTE (20) PESOS. In front of the 20 Pesos you will find the mintmark and the assayer: Which mint did your coin come from?

1870 8 Escudos: this coin was minted in seven different mints this year: Alamos (mintmark A), Chihuahua mintmark Ca), Culiacan (mintmark C), Durango (mintmark Do), Guanajuato (mintmark Go), Hermosillo (mintmark Ho), and Zacatecas (mintmark Zs). Each of these different mint's 8 Escudos for this year are valued at different prices in different grades. As with the 20 Pesos, one side of the 8 Escudos has a stylized Mexican Eagle where you found the date while the other side has a Hand on Book holding a pen with a Cap on it. You will find the mintmark for this coin after the "8E". What is the mintmark?

1859 2 Escudos: were made in only three mints this year Guadalajara (Mintmark Ga), Guanajuato (mintmark Go) and Mexico City (Mo). Again you will find the mintmark on the Hand on Book side after "2E". What is the mintmark?

Today the different coins are worth widely varying amounts depending on the mint, denomination and their grades. The 2 Escudos could be valued at a low of a couple of hundred dollars in Very Fine condition up to a high of about $850 in high-grade. The 8 Escudos could be worth as little as $900 to a high of $7,000 for the Alamos in higher grades or even more if it is GEM. The 20 Pesos can be worth as little as $850 to a high of $5,000+ for a high-grade Chihuahua.

I hope I haven't bored you too much with my babble, but you didn't ask any specific question or questions, so I'm not sure what you really wanted to know about your coins. The grade and which mint coins come from can greatly impact the value of all Mexican Republic gold, so if you want more information about your coins I will have to have more info about them.

In order to give you any more information about them I will need to know which mint each coin came from and at least scans or good photographs of them in order to try to grade them. Also if you would care to sell them? If they are really near the grades you believe, they are all very valuable because Mexican Republic gold coins are seldom found in these grades.

Tom, if you would like to talk about your coins my phone number is (956) 943-8409 and because I'm retired you can generally reach me at any time of the day and up to 11:00 PM central standard time as I live in Texas. If we are out of the house or town I have an answering machine, so just leave a message and I will return your phone call as soon as possible.

Thanks for your email and I hope I have helped you? Bye the way do you collect any coins, and I would like to know how you found our website if you don't mind telling me.

Ralph Poucher

Mexican Coin Magic     

Question #12:

Hi guys,

I recently found this (attached scan, front and back) and was wondering if you could give me any information about it.  It’s about 12mm in diameter.  I’ve tried on Internet but can’t find any info.

All the best and thanks,

Sean

Answer #12:

Dear Sean;

You have a very nice Mexican Republic 1/4 Silver Real issued in 1862 from the Mexico City Mint. From your scans it appears to be a near Mint State specimen. This tiny silver coin was the smallest denomination silver coin issued by the Mexican Republic from 1842 to 1863 and is very collectable. This coin was used in day-to-day commerce in Mexico during the early Republican Period making it very difficult to find in high-grade, which your coin is. On the side with the Lady (a stylized Lady Liberty) you will see a "Mo", which is the mintmark and indicates it was produced at the Mexico City Mint, also notice the "LR" that is the assayer's initials for this issue. These letters represent the person or persons responsible for producing the coin and are a guarantee that is of the correct weight and fineness for the coin.  There were strict penalties for creating coins that were under weight and/or of lower fineness, including a death penalty in some instances. On the other side of the coin we find the legend "REPUBLICA MEXICANA" that indicates the Republic of Mexico. The large "1/4" in the center tells us it is a 1/4 Real. Finally the "1862" is the year in which it was supposedly produced. Normally this coin weighs .846 grams and is made of silver and copper.      

You can look the coin up in a current Krause World Coin Catalog it is number KM 368.6, in the Mexico Section. You can generally find this catalog in public libraries or a local coin shop.

Current catalogs list its value at about $20.00 in Uncirculated grade, but I personally feel this price is very low for a coin of this quality. If you would like to sell it I'm sure I can find a buyer for it for at a much higher price, somewhere in the $85.00 to $100 price range, if it is as nice as it appears to be from your scans, which turned out a little fuzzy.

This said, you might want to keep the coin, as it could be the start of a nice collection of Mexican coins for you? You can find more information about the 1/4 Reales on our website, www.MexicanCoinMagic.com in Issue #7 709 Feature Article: The Republican Silver Minor Reales.

I hope this answers your question of what you have?

Thanks for your great question, and we look forward to hearing from you again, if you find any more interesting Mexican coins.

Ralph Poucher

Mexican Coin Magic

Final Note about Questions #11 & #12:

I purchased the coins mentioned in these two questions at much higher prices than listed. More about these coins, and other questions in the next issue.

Until next time, may all of your finds be great.

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